By DOUG NURSE / www.ajc.com
Friday, October 31, 2008
The city of Milton is talking with the Crooked Creek subdivision about whether to abandon city-owned roads inside the large neighborhood and allowing Crooked Creek to become a gated community.
A meeting between officials with the city and the subdivision on Thursday didn’t result in any decisions, although the city is considering lessening requirements for privatizing city streets.
The city currently requires that 100 percent of all residents in the subdivision agree to pay for future maintenance of the streets if the city abandons them to the subdivision. Crooked Creek residents say that’s unrealistic and point out that some cities have much lower requirements. City staff members will poll other cities to see what their requirement actually are.
Residents there want to limit access in and out of the 600-home subdivision because, they say, their streets often serve as a cut-through for traffic from Ga. 9 to Frances Road.
When subdivision officials initially approached the city last summer, they wanted the city first to refurbish the roads in the subdivision, which would have cost $700,000. The city balked, although it is doing some regularly scheduled maintenance in Crooked Creek.
If the city abandons the roads and subdivision becomes a gated community, Crooked Creek would become responsible for maintaining the roads.
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15 comments:
Forget Crooked Creek...bunch of obnoxious, "please us, f the rest of Milton", "crime is in our parking lot, but the kids dealing drugs that live here don't matter" jerks!
Gosh neighbor, sorry you feel that way. I have lived in Alpharetta for 10 years and find the folks who live in Crooked Creek to be very friendly. The reality is that gating their subdivision would save the taxpayers money. I am all for that.
If you allow the gating of this city street, then you should allow gating for all city streets.
Tim Enloe
770 653 0552
Boy - I thought Milton residents were a little nicer. Calling fellow residents jerks? All roads should be able to be closed if one other should?
It's a good thing we live in a democracy and people with these thoughts don't currently hold public office. At least we hope not!
Crooked Creek has a horrible traffic/public safety issue that residential subdivision streets should not have. It is a major safety liability for the city (all Milton residents share that financial risk) It is also lowering Property values and that also effects all other Milton residents negatively.
People move to the suburbs and into neighborhoods to get away from the traffic. If you choose to live on Freemanville or Providence, etc. you should reasonably expect heavy traffic but not in a subdivision. Seems fairly logical to me.
This would also be a big savings for the rest of Milton taxpayers as they would not have to provide road and infrastructure maintenance in the subdivision in the future. The Crooked Creek folks carry that burden and keep paying the same taxes as the rest of Milton with Public roads.
Crooked Creek is over 10% of the population of Milton with 2% of the land area and located next to nearly all the commercial and heavy traffic of the city.
While 80% of Milton is rural and concerned about sewer or no sewer - the residents of Crooked Creek pay the price of high density so most everyone else can live in wide open spaces. There clearly is a BIG difference.
One correction to the article. The neighborhood never asked for $700,000 - just repairs to get the roads into decent shape before the neighborhood took over all future repairs. That cost has not been determined but is no where near $700,000.
This gating project would be a huge savings over time for the City and from what I have seen of the City budget they need it. The only people who it does not benefit is the 1000 - 2000 people per day that cut through Crooked Creek everyday. Most of them live in Cherokee and Forsyth Counties.
Concerned Crooked Creek Resident
I respect the Crooked Creek Resident's opinion. However, to share my thoughts on their points, it is best to address each line by line.
1."Boy - I thought Milton residents were a little nicer."
We have some great residents; both in our subdivision and open road neighborhoods. For example, take a look at all the monies that have been raised for the Public Safety Fund which supports our fire and police officers. Also, take a look at all the volunteers taking time away from their families to help with committees as well as social functions such as the Milton Round Up. Sounds like a nice city to me.
2. "It's a good thing we live in a democracy and people with these thoughts don't currently hold public office."
Don't forget what a democracy is. It is a form of government that believes in equal treatment under the law. It appears as though this Milton resident is asking for preferential treatment.
3. "Crooked Creek has a horrible traffic/public safety issue that residential subdivision streets should not have."
I agree with you that no neighborhood; be it subdivision or open road, should experience such traffic and public safety issues. Having lost a brother to a traffic accident on Mayfield in 2000, I know more than most what can happen when our system is lax. I too have pleaded with our Police department to enforce our current speed limits in all residential nodes.To date, I have been greatly disappointed.
4. " It is also lowering Property values and that also effects all other Milton residents negatively."
I agree with this as well. Having lived on Bethany Road for over thirty years, I have seen neighbors have a difficult time selling their homes due to the severe speeding, trash, and traffic. In all instances, they have had to dramatically lower the price of their home to move it. Please keep in mind that this issue affects all residents - not just those in subdivision neighborhoods.
5. "People move to the suburbs and into neighborhoods to get away from the traffic."
In moving to the suburbs, this mind set helps to increase traffic due to the majority moving into subdivision neighborhoods. This type of lifestyle loves to have things right around the corner, from shopping to restaurants and everything in between. Thus, the traffic follows growth and growth trickles down from new subdivisions. To state that one type of lifestyle should not have to deal with the traffic that was created by that lifestyle and that another lifestyle should have to deal with traffic that they didn't create is simply wrong on so many levels.
6. "If you choose to live on Freemanville or Providence, etc. you should reasonably expect heavy traffic but not in a subdivision. Seems fairly logical to me."
Many of the families who reside in our open road neighborhoods such as Freemanville and Providence have lived here for generations. They didn't move to growth; the growth came to them. The reason we have the traffic today is due to the subdivision lifestyle and everything connected to it. Folks who live on the open roads don't like traffic either, but I haven't heard any of them requesting that their city street be closed.
7. "This would also be a big savings for the rest of Milton taxpayers as they would not have to provide road and infrastructure maintenance in the subdivision in the future. The Crooked Creek folks carry that burden and keep paying the same taxes as the rest of Milton with Public roads."
Good point. However, if the City of Milton agrees to give Crooked Creek this opportunity, then others should be given the same discretion. As you stated, we live in a democracy and under such rule, the laws should be applied equally.
8."Crooked Creek is over 10% of the population of Milton with 2% of the land area and located next to nearly all the commercial and heavy traffic of the city. "
Good point, but didn't the folks who currently live in Crooked Creek take the location of this subdivision into consideration before purchasing a home there? If you are adjacent to commercial nodes, then one would expect a higher amount of traffic. Also, it is not right to dump all the traffic currently using this city street which runs through this development onto surrounding city streets. Don't those residents have the same rights?
9. "While 80% of Milton is rural and concerned about sewer or no sewer - the residents of Crooked Creek pay the price of high density so most everyone else can live in wide open spaces. There clearly is a BIG difference."
The residents of Crooked Creek are a successful bunch. I have no doubt that they could have purchased a home in the "wide open spaces" of Milton if they had chosen to do so. Thus, your density claim carries little weight since that was the type of lifestyle that best fit your family. It should also be noted that my home's value benefits from subdivisions such as Crooked Creek. However, such subdivisions benefit from our open road neighborhoods. All one has to do is look at marketing for these communities. Nine times out of ten, the flyers will state something like "in the horse country of Milton" or something along those lines. Thus, both the subdivision and open road neighborhoods benefit off of the other.
10. " This gating project would be a huge savings over time for the City and from what I have seen of the City budget they need it. The only people who it does not benefit is the 1000 - 2000 people per day that cut through Crooked Creek everyday. Most of them live in Cherokee and Forsyth Counties. "
I have no doubt about the numbers you share - if anything, I would venture that they are even higher. Again, I must repeat, that other residents deal with the same justified greviances listed here. Bethany Road for example experiences 4500 cars daily. As a boy, we were more likely to see a horse and rider than a car.
In closing, the sooner both our residents and the City of Milton treat all residential nodes equally, the better.
According to www.dictionary.com, the first definition of the term "neighborhood" is as follows: "the area or region around or near some place or thing. "
Thus, subdivisions aren't the only neighborhoods within our city. It should also be noted that the odds of anything else being built where the subdivisions currently sit today within our lifetime are pretty low. However, those residents who reside in our open road neighborhoods cannot make the same claim. These residents can impact our subdivision communities dramatically if all were to choose to develop. If you want your property values to remain high, then become a believer in equal treatment for all those who live here. Remember, when an area is unique, it is desired. When such difference is lost, so is that advantage.
In considering the Milton of today and our open road neighborhoods, these are a benefit to those who enjoy the subdivision lifestyle.
If our council believes in equal treatment under the law, then give Crooked Creek the gating they request - just allow others who currently reside on city streets the same option should they choose to take it. Remember, equal treatment under the law. Everyone has a right to protect their property values but most importantly, the safety of their family.
Keep safe.
Tim Enloe
770 653 0552
First I sympathize with you - my sister was killed by a drunk driver with 4 prior convictions - her accident was his fifth and 100% his fault.
__
From the ads on your site it looks like you sell Real Estate for a living.
I am curious - when you have a buyer looking for a home and they ask you to show them property in a neighborhood or subdivision - Do you take them to Freemanville Rd and Birmingham Hwy, etc?
If so I would guess your client would either laugh at you or find another agent. Probably both!
I've also never heard the term 'open road neighborhood' before.
By the way - neither has Google!
CCCR
It seems to me that Crooked Creek is a bit of a fluke. Creek Club drive is a high-density street with houses relatively close together and relatively close to the street. Creek Club has become a connector in Milton over the last 5 years or so and traffic continues to increase. There are residents of Crooked Creek that lived there when Creek Club stopped at the dam and did not connect through to Francis Rd thus becoming a convenient cut-through for non-residents. This is not a new issue. The residents have fought for speed bumps and stop signs for several years. They got three stop signs (only a small part of what they asked for) about a year ago and had drivers yelling at the contractor as the signs went up. They brazenly shouted that they liked their cut-through public right of way. The requests for speed bumps were denied. Is this really the same situation as Bethany, Freemanville, Redd or other relatively low-density roads in Milton that have been there for a generation or more? Furthermore - Hwy 9 is targeted by the City of Milton for commercial growth. The city wants the tax revenue and frankly could probably not stop the development if they wanted to. Will that not inevitably increase traffic on Creek Club even more?
I think the entire City should be gated. Let's start a new trend.
Is it okay if you live on an open road and the speed limit is 45 but everyone drives 55 or more? Try pulling out of your driveway in your subdivision with cars going by at that speed. So safety is only an issue for homeowners if you live in a subdivision? But if you live on an open road, tough crap? We should expect to have to get slap run over trying to get out of our driveway? It's our fault for choosing to live on open acreage, we should just deal with it? Our lives aren't as important as yours, or our families or our children, because we live on open roads? Sounds like a huge double standard to me. I agree that both situations are dangerous and have cause for concern, and folks that live on open roads have the same right to pull out of their driveway to live another day to talk about it.
OK OK Everyone HATES growth. I think we get it already. All the above blogs say "I HATE GROWTH" But with more words.
Speed limits, laws and Julie will not stop growth!!
We need to get used to it. The next 30 years will make today look like a drive through the country.
I think some of these comments are more indicative of "I HATE OTHER PEOPLE" than of "I HATE GROWTH".
Tolerance is key.
There is an easy solution: fix the intersection at Cogburn/Hopewell/Francis and people will no longer need to cut through Crooked Creek!
Sappy crybaby!
Is Crooked Creek on Sewer?
The "sandbox bullies" are back!
Why not do a test run. Barricade the entrance and exit from Francis Rd for six months and then let CC citizens vote:
1-Do you want to continue with existing barricade?
2-Do you want to remove barricade and not ask for gates?
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